Clave Question

[Vdrummer]

Does anyone here know which clave pattern is normally used with different Latin/AfroCuban grooves? Son clave is just used with certain grooves and Rhumba others, right? I don't want to play antravasado (out of clave).

Some of the grooves I'm curious about include:

Songo
Baion
Samba
Mambo
Mozambique
Soca
Cha-Cha

and any others you know. TIA!

[S.P]

i do know one thing that your asking if my memory and knowledge does not fail me. that is that the clave doesn't apply for brazilian styles such as samba..so you gotta seperate brazilian stuff and afro cuban stuff

good luck!

you should check out the new method for afro cuban drumming by jimmy branly..its a good book!

[Henry II]

First of all, the Son and Rhumba claves are Cuban rhythms. Baion and samba are Brazillian styles. So, if you were going to play a clave with those styles, I think it would be more appropriate to use a bossa nova clave, which is identical to a 3:2 Son clave except that the second note in the second measure would be on the & of 3 instead of on 3.

As for the other styles you mentioned, I think you can play it either way. You can change it up during the song too. Rhumba clave is much more modern than Son clave. So, if you are playing a more progressive style Rhumba clave would be more appropriate. If you are going to play a clave in Cha-Cha it would definitely be a Son clave.

What's more important is knowing if it should be 3:2 or 2:3. Mambo can be either. Songo and Mosambique typically would be in 2:3. Clave is a two measure figure and depending on the song, either measure can be played first.

Soca, or Soca Rumba, I'm not as familiar with. But I think of it as more of an African/West Indian style, like calypso, than an afro-cuban style. So, I'm not sure where or if clave fits into Soca.

<font color="#a62a2a" size="1">[ August 23, 2005 06:06 AM: Message edited by: Henry II ]</font>

[ood yan]

let's me sharing my approach to clave.

I think it's similar a key for drumming, and there're 4 kinds.

_________________________________________________

1) son clave 3:2

|1|e|&|a|2|e|&|a|3|e|&|a|4|e|&|a|
|o|_|_|o|_|_|o|_|_|_|o|_|o|_|_|_|

2) rhumba clave 3:2

|1|e|&|a|2|e|&|a|3|e|&|a|4|e|&|a|
|o|_|_|o|_|_|_|o|_|_|o|_|o|_|_|_|

3) son clave 2:3

|1|e|&|a|2|e|&|a|3|e|&|a|4|e|&|a|
|_|_|o|_|o|_|_|_|o|_|_|o|_|_|o|_|

4) rhumba clave 2:3

|1|e|&|a|2|e|&|a|3|e|&|a|4|e|&|a|
|_|_|o|_|o|_|_|_|o|_|_|o|_|_|_|o|

________________________________________________

just only put the kick along 5 notations each of clave, and play snare on backbeat 2&4 in the same time, you guys can feel to the absolutely separable groove.

_________________________________________________

only Soca i'd copied from the booklet in cd (Exotic Rhythms of Latin America)

Soca: is a musical from that belongs to the English and French speaking people of the Caribbean (Trinidad, Tobago, Bahamas, Martinique, Guadalupe, etc.) Something that people associate with kind of music is the Limbo Dance and the sounds of the steel drums. The steel drums are perhaps the youngest family of acoustic instruments invented in the 1950's. This stye of music is ususally performed by steel bands or ensembles that are formed by rhythm section, brass section, electric guitar and vocals. It is one of the most party like rhythms of that side of the world.

[hanayalator]

Ya generally the dance styles will have a 2-3 clave, and the more folkloric ones will be 3-2, although it totally depends on the song, and it can also switch halfway through the tune. Let your ear decide which way it should be (most tunes are written around the clave, so the rest of the parts will fit in nicely, or clash if you're going against it).

[Dazzler]

A simple answer - The melody will dictate the clave direction. [img]cool.gif[/img]

[Vdrummer]

Thanks for the responses guys! I know what clave is already, and I'm aware of the six claves mentioned Son, Rhumba and Bossa, in 2:3 and 3:2 versions (plus the 12/8 claves for Bembe). I just wasn't sure about if they could be applied from culture to culture, or if it was more specific. Your replies are helping clarify some of my confusion.

I use the Bossa clave with those Brazilian rhythms. It also makes sense that the Son clave would suit Cha-Chas better since its a more traditional style. I just didn't know if there were hard and fast rules to it and what they were. Thanks again.

[cjbdrm]

Check out these books- get your information from the source. You're a teacher, right? You need these:

Afro-Cuban

Brazilian

Brazilian

Afro-Cuban

[drumgod1]

Check this book out as well. Doug Auwarter is my current teacher and quite knowledgable of these rhythms. His book is filled with knowledge, check it out!

http://www.dougauwarter.com/book.htm

Audio examples are also on the site.

Mike

[Vdrummer]

We have those books at work. I'll have to pick up a couple. Is anyone else here working on left foot clave patterns?